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NOTES FOR MORMON DEBATE

GOD’S UNCREATED EXISTENCE

“Lord, You have been our dwelling place in all generations. Before the mountains were born Or You gave birth to the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God.” Psalm 90:1-2 New American Standard Bible (NASB)

Before the mountains existed (pro tou ore geneetheena), and [before] the earth and the world were formed, even from age to age, You are.” Psalm 89:2 LXX

“The Lord reigns, He is clothed with majesty; The Lord has clothed and girded Himself with strength; Indeed, the world is firmly established, it will not be moved. Your throne is established from of old; You are from everlasting.” Psalm 93:1-2 NASB

“Now all glory to God, who is able to make you strong, just as my Good News says. This message about Jesus Christ has revealed his plan for you Gentiles, a plan kept secret from the beginning of time (chronois aiooniois). But now as the prophets foretold and as the eternal God (tou aiooniou Theou) has commanded, this message is made known to all Gentiles everywhere, so that they too might believe and obey him.” Romans 16:25-26 New Living Translation (NLT)

CREATION OF TIME

“No, we declare God’s wisdom, a mystery that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began (pro toon aioonoon).” 1 Corinthians 2:7

“in the hope of eternal life, which God, who does not lie, promised before the beginning of time (pro chronoon aioonioon),” Titus 1:2 NIV

“He has saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time (pro chronoon aioonioon),” 2 Timothy 1:9 NIV

  1. without beginning or end, that which always has been and always will be: Θεός,Romans 16:26(ὁ μόνος αἰώνιος, 2 Macc. 1:25); πνεῦμα, Hebrews 9:14.
  2. without beginning: χρόνοιςαἰωνίοις,Romans 16:25; πρόχρόνων αἰωνίων, 2 Timothy 1:9Titus 1:2; εὐαγγέλιον, a gospel whose subject-matter is eternal, i. e., the saving purpose of God adopted from eternity, Revelation 14:6. (Thayer’s https://biblehub.com/greek/166.htm)

 CREATION EX NIHILO

In the beginning God CREATED the heavens and the earth. The earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.” Genesis 1:1-2

“By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had CREATED and made. This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were CREATED, in the day that the LORD God made earth and heaven.” Genesis 2:1-4

“You alone are the LORD. You have made the heavens, The heaven of heavens with all their host, The earth and all that is on it, The seas and all that is in them. You give life to all of them And the heavenly host bows down before You.” Nehemiah 9:6

“Worthy are You, our Lord and our God, to receive glory and honor and power; for You created all things, and because of Your will they existed, and were created.” Nehemiah 9:6

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things CAME INTO BEING (egeneto) through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that HAS COME INTO BEING (gegonen). In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.”

  1. to become, i. e. to come into existence, begin to be, receive being: absolutely… John 8:58(πρίνἈβραάμ γενέσθαι)…  of the origin of all things… John 1:3, 10… (Thayer’s https://biblehub.com/greek/1096.htm)

“He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were CREATED (ekisthe), both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been CREATED (ektistai) through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.” Colossians 1:16-17

Strong’s Concordance

 ktizó: to build, create

Original Word: κτίζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: ktizó
Phonetic Spelling: (ktid’-zo)
Definition: to build, create
Usage: I create, form, shape, make, always of God.

HELPS Word-studies

 2936 ktízō – properly, create, which applies only to God who alone can make what was “not there before” (Latin, ex nihilo, out of nothing, J.Thayer); figuratively to begin (“found”), especially what is habitable or useful.

[This is also the meaning of this term from Homer to Josephus.] (Biblehub https://biblehub.com/greek/2936.htm)

Noted Evangelical NT scholar Murray J. Harris clarifies the implications of the two tenses that are used for Jesus creating all things:

“In the prologue to the Fourth Gospel, however, John states that ‘through him [the eternal Word] all things were made; without him nothing has been made that has been made’ (John 1:3). Here the Greek word for ‘all things’ (panta) draws attention to the multiplicity and diversity of creation. In Colossians 1:16, on the other hand, the Greek for ‘all things’ (ta panta) means ‘all things collectively,’ with the emphasis being on the sum total of reality… Two other points in this remarkable verse are worthy of note. The prepositional phrase in him indicates that in the very person of Christ resides the creative energy that produced the universe. John simply says that ‘in him was life’ (John 1:4), while Peter refers to him as ‘the author of life’ (Acts 3:15). The other notable feature is the subtle distinction, lost in many English translations, that Paul makes between the two tenses of creation (ektisthe… ektistai). A paraphrase of the verse will highlight the distinction:

It was in his person that all things in heaven and on earth were once created, things that can be seen by the human eye, and those things that cannot be seen, whether they be angelic occupants of heavenly thrones or supernatural beings who exercise dominion or rule or authority–all these things were created, and now exist, through him and for him

“The universe has an ongoing relationship to Christ…” (Crucial Questions about Jesus [Baker Books, Grand Rapids, MI 1994], II. Divine Functions Exercised by Jesus, A. In relation to the Universe, 1. Jesus Is The Creator, pp. 80-81; bold emphasis mine)

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